Redefining Resilience & Embracing Change

0:00 Hello and welcome to Real Men Feel. I'm your host, author, coach and healer, Andy Grant. Before we get going today, I want to show you something. This is the Silver Signal award that Real Men Feel recently received for being the most inspirational podcast. So they give out awards bronze, silver and gold. We got the silver and the gold went to Mel Robbins. So it's a pretty amazing company and I wanted to show this to you because whether this is the first episode you're ever seeing or the three hundreds, you are part of this. Without you, I'm I'm talking to myself, which does sometimes happen but doesn't win anything. Real men feel exists to remind men that they are human beings and they have the right and the need to express and experience all of their emotions.

0:48 We have conversations that most men are not having, but that all men can benefit from. My guest today is John Emery. John was a typical American man, doing all the things he'd been told to do while growing up. He had a good job, he got married, he built the home, he became a father. Then job loss and divorce rocked him, and he realized he didn't know who he was. Today, John is a podcaster and a podcast coach, helping other people share their resilience and joy. We discuss ways to navigate life's challenges, working through fear, the importance of knowing your values, and much more. John shares what helped him the most, including a morning routine, gratitude, and how he attempts to pass this on to his kids too. Let's do it.

1:32 Hello and welcome to Real Midfield, John. All right. Yeah. Thanks for having me. So we're recording this on November 19th and that is International Men's Day. Did you realize that? You know, I just saw something like on a Tik Toker when I'm like, what is this? I never. I didn't know that. Yeah, so I I first heard of it like four years ago maybe and I forget though it's just this day. So I don't know what could happen supposed to happen, but in an ideal. World. In an ideal world, how would you like to see International Men's Day observed? I I was thinking this should be it, almost like a Father's Day kind of deal, right? Where everybody should be appreciated as a man, I I think that's how it should be recognized.

2:12 How to celebrate that? I don't know, Like, you know, most men are like, just leave me alone, you know, Like you know. That's why I intention I that's why I intentionally asked observed forces celebrated. So you didn't, you didn't have to have a celebrate. Yeah. Just so, yeah, there's a men's day card just like kind of a thanks for being a good man, sort of a interaction with people. Yeah, I think a handshake or something, right? Yeah. Thanks for showing up. No no, may pole dance or something. I was trying to think of what what flavor cake is men like, I don't know. I don't know. That's horrible. So we talked briefly before, and what I came out of our conversation is that you're a man that did everything you thought you were supposed to do, but still your life kind of fell apart. Set up your good life before things took a turn. Sure.

3:06 So I, my good life was get a job. You know, first, at first I was going to college for a little bit, but I was working full time at the same time and I'm like, what the heck do I need college for? So I wind up staying full time at the job. I was at the job for years. I wind up meeting somebody when I was young, I was 19 and you know, we just started dating and we got to get, you know, engaged and married and stuff. And I'm forget the exact age I was. I want to say maybe 2425 ish. I got married, but, yeah, so we got married and, you know, I held that job for 20 years because we decided to close down after 20 years. And through that 20 years, I wound up getting some rental properties. I'm like, oh, this is great.

3:47 And I found another way to make a stream of income if I ever wanted to get out of a job. And then, you know, we wound up having two lovely children along the way. We got our own house that we decided to live in, and that's where we raised the children. Yeah. So I, I mean, I thought that was great. I that's everything I remember being taught or kind of showed, maybe not like pushed in this direction, but showed, Hey, you know, you should, you should get a job, provide for the family and then, yeah, have that family, have a house, have the car, go on vacations and then try to have a four O 1K and all that stuff. You know, did did that feel good to you? Did did you feel fulfilment?

4:28 Did it feel like it was right and working? Yes, at the time, sure, absolutely. I, I think it's at that point where I was like, there's got to be something else, right? And I just didn't know what that was. And that's why I was kind of like looking for the rental properties as a like an owl. And I never followed through with it. I never had a mentor or coach. I just dove in, you know. So, So what did happen that brought all of this, you know, doing the the idealized version of what you're supposed to do What, what brought that to an end? Yeah, So the job I was at for 20 years, they decided to close. It was around COVID, not due to COVID, but they just weren't performing. They said I got to watch like 60 people leave after production was done.

5:10 I was in the warehouse shipping area, so I was there and for another eight months after they left, and I was one of the three left, so I was one of the people. We stripped the whole place clean. I forget how big this place was. Huge. All the machines were gone. All the racking was gone, all the inventory. And so I didn't know what to do it at the time. I'm so I finally found a way out, you know, like in a weird way and I don't know what I was going to do. And so I had the time to kind of relax a little bit, kind of take it in and you know, somebody I knew was an insurance. And so I venture into the insurance Bureau, totally different.

5:51 Not a nine to five, not a steady income or anything like that. And I started to enjoy worrying what it had to provide for other people on NASA are making videos and stuff and trying to connect with people. And that led me into, you know, trying to kind of got me into podcasting eventually down the road, but that's, it's a little further away. But in that same year, I something it's things were happening and I didn't, I didn't see things happening for a while, apparently. And I, I was focusing on all of that stuff. And February within that's almost a year after I lost my job, you know, things were shaky at the house with as far as with my marriage.

6:35 And we were married for almost 15 years. We did wind up getting a divorce. It was nothing that I was looking for. I got prepared for myself for it in a sense, because I wound up jumping on a podcast listening to somebody, and it was a men's podcast and it was something I listened to two years prior to that so I could be a better father. I wanted to show as a better father for my children. Anyways, I jumped on that. They had a men's group. You know, you can join all these seminars or whatever you want to call it to get to know men better and everything. And I didn't get a chance to do that. I was with my kids at night, so I wanted to try to spend as much time as I could because I didn't know where things were going.

7:15 I, I was losing, I lost 20 lbs. I, I couldn't sleep. I was trying to figure everything else that was going on in the, in the house. What, what, why is this all happening? I, I couldn't figure it out. Anyways, joining that men's group in a sense, I, I connected with about 5 men and it was like, I want to call it like a lifeline, right? So if you, you were trying to figure something out, you can call somebody. If they didn't answer, you call somebody else. And those guys were either going to, you know, right there for you and they're going to tell you this stuff. Hey, you don't want to hear it, but this is what's happening. Like one guy said, you're headed in a divorce. And I'm like, what? I mean, like, and this is like, I'm just like telling him what's going on.

7:59 He's like, yeah, I, I know. I'm like, oh, great. And that was like months before he even came up from, from her mouth. But it, it did that kind of help me to prepare for when that word did come up. So I was like, OK, you know, let's well, I'm done. I'm not trying to figure this out anymore. And so, yeah, so like, so I went through the job loss, I went through the divorce all within about the same year that it got finalized. Thereafter, it took a while, but that was different. Like I had to find myself again and or, you know, figure out who I really was because I, I share this. I, I felt like it was in a mold, you know, like I was, hey, you got to get the job, got to have the kids, got to have the wife, got to have the house, got to have all that stuff. And now I'm like free.

8:46 And so I was able to kind of figure things out and I'm still on that journey. So, so how did losing your job, losing your marriage, how did, how specifically did that change your outlook on life and fatherhood even? Yeah, I so it changed how it's like the the job is not everything is cracked out to be like it. You know, I loved what I was doing and I love the people, but it can like it can pull you down, bring your energy down a lot, right. And and I want to say I didn't know who I was because I was working. I came home and I took care of the house and stuff and like, and I was just in a routine. I was just stuck and I didn't find that out. Now I have it's, I don't want it's, it's, it's weird to say this in a weird way, right?

9:35 I have to like an out in a way, right where I have all this, I have this time to sit down and talk to you because I, I just don't have the kids every day anymore. So it's, you know, and it's, that's what, this is what I do. Like I've been creating things. I still work a full time job, but I've been creating things, podcasting, I've been creating events that I have coming up and everything like that. So like my mind's opened up and it took a while for me to get there because I had to work on myself and all the areas that I felt like I had to work on. It was. It was not easy. Yeah. What helped you most in navigating these major transitions? The thing that helped me the most I'm going to say I well, first I start with myself mentally. So it was still continue to talk to these guys every once in a while and you get to it was still it was me starting to create a morning routine and that still continues today. I did shift a few things a little bit, but you know, now, like now I'm praying like that.

10:34 That's the game changer for me. I meditate and I write what I'm grateful for and I'll listen to something positive and I just I feel like I have a better outlook in life, Like I'm thankful to be alive, right? Things could be so much worse. You can, you can you see all these bad stories that and I had people come on and share their stuff on my podcast. I, I don't know how they got through it like I, but we all have our own journey with our own experiences we have to go through. So they probably don't know how I got through what I I went through, you know. So yeah, I would say, I would say the morning routine was a great start for me. So so tell me about the podcast. Tell me about life's check mark. How how did what what was the transition to finally realize? Yeah, but I don't know.

11:17 Did you finally a podcast is the answer Like what? What made that happen? You know, right, So I, I'll share with you. I, when I was doing the insurance stuff, I created 5 or not 5-10 Facebook lives with entrepreneurs just to get to know about the entrepreneur field, right? And then I stopped when went in a different direction. Anyways, about a year or so after divorce work came up. I wound up going to an event where a podcaster is close to me. And it wasn't about podcasting. It was just about growth, right? And so I sat down at a breakfast, breakfast table with him and some other people. Everybody got to the left. But this one guy, he's like, what do you want to do? And I'm like, I like, I don't know, create a podcast, right?

12:00 And I'm. And he's like, OK to do it. I'm like, well, I don't have everything ready. I don't have it. So I said, I have these 10, you know, Facebook lives and he's like, we'll just start with that. Just strip the audio and do that. You know, it took me 6 months from that time that he said something to me before I even attempted to strip the audio. And it didn't take long. And so I did that. I watched it. I I explained in episode 0, these are the 10 and, and this is what they are, but they're after this is what it's going to be. And so that's how it got me started. And then it just transitioned from there. But yeah, for me to say podcast, the way it is now is I, you know, I can actually understand how people get through things. And I and I asked them questions just like you did, you know, what was like the biggest thing that, you know, changed my life to get me going because then I could take that information in and I can apply it in my life if I decide to do so. And so can my listeners.

13:00 In hindsight, what do you think prevented you from taking action for those six months from the idea to the suggested idea, at least to you acting on it? It was fear. It was me thinking, I can't do it. Who who wants to listen, right? And then it took me a while to go, who cares if anybody listens? Let's just do it. And and that's, that's where that's the question I ask people today if they're going to start a podcast, would you do it if nobody listened? And that's really what it comes down to. I've been doing the podcast for eight years. I've been a filmmaker, I've worked on TV, all sorts of different things. And my own is like, I make things that I enjoy, and if someone else comes along for the ride, great. But if they don't, I still enjoy making the thing I made. So it sounds like you're in that kind of same position. Yeah.

13:43 Yeah, yeah, I enjoy it. So was that first? Were those first live streams that was that life's check mark then? Or did it? Was that something else? Yeah, I just made the podcast Life's Check Mark, but I just said hey, these in episode 0, I said, hey, these first ten are from this and that's not what it's going to be about. Episode 11 thereafter. Is this what it's going to be about? All right, So what is it about? It's about people coming on, sharing their journey in life, being authentic, honest, open and vulnerable and just a conversation kind of just like what we're doing here. And I just, I just enjoy hearing what they experience and how they are getting, you know, to where they are going in the future and on the other side and what, and you know, how they're helping others.

14:31 So you mentioned authenticity be important. What does authenticity mean to you and and especially in relationship with others? Yeah, showing up as yourself and not really caring if they're like you or not and, you know, telling them how things are sometimes and let them know that it's a safe space, but it's just how things are. And if you don't like me for me, then that's you don't have to be around me. Just go ahead and move on if you wanted to. And that it's got me in that place, like, OK. And and that's why, you know, I'll, I'll enjoy having the guests come on or people I meet in the world world. And they had events and stuff.

15:14 It's it's, it gives you that place to is it going to attract the right people? Right. And that's, and that's what you need, you know, not, not try the people, please. You know, I hear that a lot still and and you can see it. So like if if you study and and you start reading things, listening to things, you can kind of watch what people do and you just like, I got it. That's that's what they are. That's what they're doing, you know, and their behavior and how they're, you know, saying things. It's it's just fine, right? I don't know everything, but just learning a few things, you know, and then you just watch a few few more stuff and you just like, yeah, yeah, I did see that person do that. They did say that to me, yeah. So being authentic, it actually became one of my values. So that's something I want to stick by for as small as I live. Prior to your life transitions, were you aware of had you labeled your values?

16:10 I want to say yes, but I'm going to say no. I never sat down and go, this is these are my values. After everything I experienced, I can say I showed up with my values and you know, at least some of them I would say yes. You know, being authentic is a new one for me because I never felt like I was myself I guess in the past. But I got kind of loyal, loving and I'm always looking to grow. So those are my 5 and I have it right over here. So that's why I could just keep. Yeah, I have no problem sharing things like that with anybody because it makes me feel better knowing I know what they are. So how has your personal growth and journey affected your relationship with your children?

16:56 It's kind of tough because I don't see them, you know, I see them every seven days. So I do try to text them, try to call them, and it's a hit or miss sometimes too. I do. For me, I do say, hey, have you wrote? When they're with me, I asked them to write in their journal like what they're grateful for. I asked them to read for 10 pages today. And then I do take them to church. If I go to church to Sundays, I have them. So that part has grown. And obviously they're probably don't care about most of it. But eventually, sometime down the road, they'll be like, oh, that's why I did it. You know what I mean? Who knows? I don't know. And plus, I have everything, social media and stuff. If they wanted to, they can check it all out. I don't know if they are or not.

17:39 Every once in a while my son's like, oh, I see you got like 13 views on that last one. I'm like, oh, you know, you're looking. You know, whether he listens to, I doubt it. But so I tried to show up better as a father in a sense. Like my daughter has soccer games. So I go there and I'll put the phone away and I'll say the same thing to my son. If you're going to come, just put the phone away. Don't you know it's an hour if that, right? And let's just be present. Let's focus on the time that we have now. And I tried to tell them a few things too, of, you know, stuff I've experienced in life. Again, it probably doesn't hit home right away. They had their friends and everything else that they consume. And I'm one person. So it's kind of tough. Besides putting the phone away, is there any advice you have for fathers looking to make a deeper relationship with their children?

18:28 Yeah, You know what I enjoy? I I enjoy taking my daughter with me when I go to grocery shopping and she's stuck in the car. She can't get away. And she just talks. She just says everything that she probably been holding in forever, just about her day or week or whatever it is. And it's just, it's, it's rewarding as a father to hear everything. And, you know, my son's not as verbal, but I'm sure he would say a lot of stuff too if it was just him. If it's both of them, it's kind of hard. But yeah, it's that like one-on-one time you get out and you go do an activity. I I took him to go hiking for, you know, like a good hour or two. And, you know, we just drove around. Not much was said all the time. I mean, it's kind of like a man to it was father the son, obviously.

19:12 But it's it's kind of tough to bring out some stuff sometimes so that I have to work on because I know he needs that too. But yeah, it's it's getting them in that one-on-one areas and having those conversations. I tried to build up the the conversations. Like for example, I'll be like, how was your day today? Right. I used the word Hal and they go fine, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, all right, you know, I I'm trying you're in so different conversations, like every minute. And it's like, OK, but they want. Some tips for that like so I I know you coached through the podcasting and I've been working as a coach for good go at 14 years. Ask more open-ended questions. Don't ask a question that could be answered with a fine like what was the best part of the day? Right I I tried that too too.

19:59 Nothing. Then what was the worst part of the day? No, I, I kid you not, man. I'm like, all right. So in addition to your podcasting with life's check mark, I know you're also kind of a podcast coach. You help other people get going. Is that correct? Yeah, yeah, I created a coaching program because I I found love in what I do as a podcaster. And I believe other people have that same drive, whatever that is, from why they want to create a podcast. They just don't go. And so I want to be that person to get them, but you know, be behind them to get them going and keep going. All right. And so that's, that's my main goal here. That's for starting the podcast. And I actually have a community starting tomorrow with like 12 other podcasters.

20:41 So we can keep on pushing each other and and learn new things because I don't know everything, you know, and everybody else has other ideas that they used or whatever, whether it's to grow or they get guest or whatever. So it's it's all just about keep moving forward. You know, a lot of people, you know, podcasters just fade away after a while because they just find out how much work it actually has. But if you have the joy to do it, then that should be the main drive for to keep moving forward. What are the are there most common challenges that you had and that you see other people having as well? Yeah, the most common challenges I I find is people, you know, they just get, they get stuck. They just like, you know, I see that next guest, like who am I going to get to be on the next guest? Or how can I, it's like figure out your schedule too. You have to find time to schedule your podcast episodes that you're going to record, whether it's solo or whether it's going to be with a guest.

21:40 And with a guest, it's a little hard. That guest might not show up, so you might be behind one. So that's why you kind of you, you might want to have a backlog, you know, some ready to go just in case, or you do a quick solo episode to fill in the gap. So there's stuff like that. And then, you know, everybody dives in where they get into the nitty gritty of stuff and they go, you know, the best description, the best title. And like, I get that, but you're focusing on just that you're you're putting too much focus on one area. So I just want to make for me, I just want to make things simple. Just just to have it go and then you can change things along the way, one thing at a time. Yeah, that's how we just just take action. You can especially, especially your own creation. You can change the title, change the set, you can change everything but do something.

22:27 Yeah, nobody's going to know. Yeah, right. Yeah, yeah. And yeah. If you're first anything has nobody watching it, no one needs to know. It's called the next one. Episode 1. Like it. Yeah, it doesn't really matter. Has anything in helping others find their voice, share their joy via podcasting? Has any has how has it influenced you back? Like what's come back to you for doing that? See them actually, yeah, see them actually grow and just keep moving forward and actually have something because it was like a dream, right? It's almost like I want to, you can call it a business if you want. You want to build a business and you actually go ahead and you get a loan and you do all this work and then you have a business, you know, and same thing with the podcast.

23:08 You do all this stuff 1st and then you launch it. Like that's how it should be. Not just pick one episode and and launch it. But yeah, the joy of the sea, people actually create something and keep moving forward and keep wanting to do it because it not only helps the other people listening, but it's going to help you sell yourself as a host. I don't know about you, but when I had guests come on, I absorb all the energy and I I could take in, take what I want or, and leave every whatever else I want behind. But people share what they go, hey, this is what I did to get through that. And I'm like, well, that's a great idea. Maybe I should try that, you know? And so that's, that's what I enjoy the most with having a guest come on my show. But yeah, so I I like to see people just keep moving forward. But when when you coach someone and they launch their podcast or they change it or they're like, what does that give to you? What do you get from that?

24:02 Yeah, the the joy and the excitement of them actually doing what they wanted to create, You know that you. Feel their joy. That's why I want to be behind them. I'm tell me what your tell me your why tell me what is your desire, your passion that you want to create a podcast. What is it? And they'll tell you and then you're right there. OK, that's great. Let's stick with that. What's now? Let's get moving before because, and I say that you want that first. You want to know why you're going to have a podcast? Because you're going to probably come up and go, nobody's listening. What why did I start this? And then you have to go back and you go, oh, I, I started because of this, OK. But when we keep moving forward and that's, you know, you know, it's a, it's a long game, right?

24:44 It's not going to happen overnight. It's, you know, it could be 3, five years, it could be a long time, who knows? But it's just have the joy, just keep moving forward. But yeah, it's so for me, it's to see them actually just keep going. Are there anything that a skill set, something you had within you didn't realize, that you discovered in dealing with the job loss and divorce that is also new in podcasting? I feel like, I don't know if I always had this, but I feel like I can listen better. For instance, I just had somebody on before this one before jumping on here with you and he basically shared his whole journey and I just sat there and let him have it. And it was, it was a conversation still, but, and why am I going to interject if he's sharing his journey and I really might want to hear what he has to say. So I gave him the space.

25:36 Not every podcaster is going to do that. But that's just who I am. That's, that's me as a person. So I feel like I'd be carrying a better listener and learn to pause in a sense where you can count the four, right? So if I stop, you'll count the four. And then I might say something else because it could be a deeper conversation thereafter or I might be done. Yeah. So that's, that's what I, I feel like. And and that's why I'm trying to work with the kids too. I'm trying to ask them those questions and, and have a better conversation and be present. And it's, it took me a long time to get where I am today. And I'm not perfect. I'm not where I think I want to be, but I'm definitely striving to make myself better.

26:19 I want to dig into that. So not perfect, right? Nobody's perfect and you're not where you want to be. So does that mean where you want to be is perfection? No, you'll never hit perfect, right? It's all about progress. It's about just keep moving forward, right. Yeah, There's no such thing as perfect. I don't believe in that. Yeah, bad word to use there. But thank you for bringing that back to me. No, I just want to keep getting better. Right. And that's that's how you do it. Yeah. So you think perfect is X because somebody else already is there and you're just not them. And but once you get there, then there's another perfect, right? You just like, oh, this never ends. But it's, it's all about the process. It's and just continuing to move forward, always learning, trying to implement things that that's why I enjoy the most. And that's why I enjoyed the podcasting. Like it took me a while to strip out. It took me a while to post it all and now I got into the video and everything like that, so it's all a learning process. Is there a practice, a program, a book that that helped you, that you would like to recommend to other men? That's a great question.

27:28 I can, I can, can I? I'll look it up real quick if it's so first I'm going to say the four, the four agreements is great for not just men, but for everybody. So that's like second to my Bible. So the and these were recommended to me by somebody I would consider a coach, one of those guys I met when I was asking for advice. So understanding women is great. It's more of a conference because it was recorded for that, but it's a way to understand behavior and what they're thinking and how we think as a man compared to them. The way of the superior man is another one.

28:10 But yeah, those are those are I know, but they're there like I and I, I I listened to the four agreements and I was listening to the understand women again when I was driving the floor with. So it was just like you got, you got to just keep on taking the same stuff in sometimes. So it sounds like you got lots of good advice and support from the men's group that you And what advice would you give the man that currently, you know, feels like he did it all and lost it all and feels empty, lost, not sure who he is. Yeah, I'll, I'll be honest with you and vulnerable here that I feel like I have not found everything yet. So I'm still moving forward. And yeah, they feel like they lost it all. I would give them hope.

28:58 I would give them the place to be safe and talking. And I guess my podcast is one of those places sometimes where people just come on and they obviously they're, they experience something already, but they open up too. And they go, oh, I didn't realize I went through all that to get to where I am today. I, I, I'll be Andy, if, if anybody's listening to this and they just want to lean on someone, I will open up my e-mail or whatever, Facebook, whatever, If they just need to message me for whatever they're going through it, you know, and if I don't have all the advice in the world, I would find somebody else that can help them. But I would definitely be willing to be that person to, you know, I'm here if you need to talk or something like that. You know, I might not be available for everything, but I, I, I'm here like I, I listen to people on podcasts all the time. So why not?

29:53 Yeah, if you can make that space, make that's the area for people to especially men just to listen because we don't, we shut men down. So it sounds like to me that the advice for someone is, is to reach out to you, to me, to a friend, to someone that feels safe. Just don't keep it in. Yeah, sorry, yeah, I didn't, I didn't answer that, I guess. But it it is, it is, yeah. Reach out. I and I know that's hard because it it was hard for me to reach out. It was hard for me to go call that podcast and go, what's this about with this program you have per month? And then I and then I met these men and I'm like, this is just weird is it's just not me. This is not meant for me, but when I found out that 10 men commit suicide every day from divorce and I am not one of them, that makes it even well worth it. I had no idea about that prior to talking to these guys. And you know, I don't know where I was going to go. I didn't say, I'm not saying I had those thoughts, but I who knows?

30:51 I don't know. But it was something that hit me and I didn't see common and it's something I never would have wanted in my life because I was always not taught, but kind of just did not want that to happen. So for me to experience it and try to figure all out was tough. So yeah, definitely reach out to somebody if you feel like you're in a tough spot. Or I'll tell you what, if you think somebody's in a tough spot, ask them if they're OK. You know, how are you doing and not fine, No, how are you? You know, I asked them two or three times because that's probably when you're going to get the answer. Yeah, 11 tip I got from a positive psychology professor years ago was how are you really? Yeah, there you go. That's right.

31:34 What do you hope listeners take away from life's check mark? I hope that they could take away that it they're not alone that somebody else experienced what they're going through. And here's the blueprint in a sense of how somebody else went through it. That's that's what I hope my mission, my mission is somebody can listen to it and they go, oh, I needed to hear that because I know something could have happened to me. I need to get through this or somebody can share it to somebody they know. That's the whole mission behind it for me, and it's just going to be that one person. What's the best way for people to find out more about you The podcast, the. Coaching everything you're up to. Sure. So you can find me on Facebook, Jonathan, dot, Emery, something or whatever.

32:16 You just look it up. Yeah, you see my handsome face. Wife's checkmark.com is all with the coaching program and podcast whose hub, which is the community. You can go ahead and look me up on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Life's check markets, life's with the apostrophe and the check mark. Big check mark of the guy walking up, the check mark with life's check mark on it, and the check mark is orange just like this while back here. Cool. Well, John, thanks for taking the time to to talk to me today and Share your story and your love and healing through podcasts and inviting other people to find their Lovejoy and excitement and, and their through their podcasts. And you know, all, all energy is contagious. Everything is circular, everything is give and take. So you know, I love, I love stories where, you know, men share their journey and then share how they're being serviced to the world.

33:09 And just think, in case you haven't accepted it, don't realize it, you were being serviced to the world that the podcast has a long tail. Any anytime I believe that anytime any man is vulnerable in public, it gives some new list, new person permission who didn't realize that was even possible. So thanks for doing what you're doing. Yeah, thank you for having me on here. And that was well said. I agree with you completely. Cool. So thanks for everyone for joining. Listening us today. Please visit realmenfield.org. See the blog post for this episode. We'll have links to all the various resources mentioned. Wherever you're discovering Real Men Feel, please subscribe, follow, like, share this episode with somebody, post a review or a comment.

33:52 If you're not yet in the Real Men Feel Private Facebook group, you can join by the Real menfeel.org/group. You can talk to me at realmenfeel@gmail.com. Until next time, be good to yourself.