Firefighter Health Revolution: Breaking Fire Service Myths

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The true warrior.
Is not somebody who performs

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well, it's somebody who has
mastery over themselves.

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It is somebody who.
Realizes that the real battle

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is.
Within that, the real struggle

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is within and to address that
it's not what happens in the

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world around us it.
Is how we.

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Respond to that.
Hello and welcome to Real Men

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Feel, I'm your host Andy Grant.
Today we're diving into the

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heart of service, strength and
self-care with a man who knows

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all three inside and out.
Robbie Nebergall is a veteran

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firefighter, fitness coach,
martial artist and founder of

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Reclaim, a lifestyle based
program helping firefighters

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transform their health and
reclaim their lives.

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Robbie has seen first hand how
the job can grind you down.

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And what it takes to build
yourself back up.

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We talked about smashing the
stigma around mental health,

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bringing change to a culture
that is harming men, and what it

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means for firefighters to thrive
in retirement because not enough

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of making it there.
And hey, if you're looking for a

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space to get real and connect
with others doing the inner

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work, join my free community,
Authentic AF at

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realmenfield.org/group.
Let's do it.

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Hello Robbie, and welcome to
Real Men Field.

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Hey, thanks for having me man.
So Robbie, did you always want

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to be a?
Firefighter, you know, honestly,

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I, I didn't, but I did have an
uncle who was in the fire

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service and for a long time, you
know, he was encouraging me to

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maybe look into it.
It wasn't until later on that I

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actually kind of took that.
Seriously.

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I I.
I.

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I went down a lot of different
roads.

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Before I arrived.
At being a.

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Firefighter, but every job that
I've had.

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Up to this point, did have the
common theme of like in some

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way, shape or form being of.
Service.

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So that was.
That was the common denominator,

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and then eventually I started
listening to him.

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And did your experiences match
any of the hype that your uncle?

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Laid out for you.
You know, it's kind of like with

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anything, right?
Like the grass is.

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Always is always.
Greener you know what what you

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expect something to be.
It's not usually as glamorous as

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you imagine.
There are some things that I

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will take with me for life that
have been overwhelmingly

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positive.
And then just like anything

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else, like any other.
Job, The stuff that you do go

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through, the stuff that weighs.
On you and the stuff.

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That you would you?
Never would have known to expect

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unless you did.
It is is, you know what plays

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into the equation there.
So yeah.

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And I imagine it's like that
with with any job where you just

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think, oh, it's going to be so
amazing.

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And then like, of course it
comes along, comes with the

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territory.
There are these things that you

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don't expect and that that can
be detrimental.

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And and you've been in fire
service for 25.

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Years.
Is that right?

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I have not been in the fire
service for 25.

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Years.
That's usually the.

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Extent that most.
Firefighters go to SO.

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A normal career in the fire
service.

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Is.
Usually 20 to 25 years and then

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they they go to retirement.
Right, a lot of firefighters

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either work for.
You know, a pension or something

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like that.
Now there's some variance in

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there like, but 20 to 25 is the
normal.

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I've been in the fire service
for four years, personally.

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Looking at some of those people
with with the 20 year plus

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career, what sort of toll do you
see this job take on on them

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physically and mentally?
I mean, that's a, that's a

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loaded question, man.
And.

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The the toll.
Physically and mentally can be.

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Drastically.
Different depending on how that

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person takes care of themselves
in the course of that 20 or 25.

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Years, but the job.
On its own.

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You could.
You could probably do.

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Everything perfectly and you're
still going to have some years

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off of your life in the process.
That being said, you can lean

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into some of those things even
more.

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If you don't have the
appropriate coping mechanisms,

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you don't.
Have the appropriate.

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Routines you don't have the
structure in.

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Place to protect yourself the.
Cost of making it to your

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retirement, if you even make it
at all.

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And that is, that is a.
Statement that should be.

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Taken with gravity like.
There's a lot of.

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Firefighters that don't even
make it to their retirement, you

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want to talk?
About the toll.

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To often their life.
If.

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They lean into some of these
negative.

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Habits that we have.
Around like coping with what?

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We see what we deal with the.
Sleep deprivation, The chronic.

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Stress the fatigue so.
Physically and mentally, you

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know.
The the rate of suicide.

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Among firefighters is much
higher than in the general

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population.
In fact, I can say personally,

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in just the four years I've been
in the fire service, there have

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been 3 suicides in neighboring
departments since I started.

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Those are the ones.
That are actually talk because

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they.
Not every time it happens is it

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made public or made known.
That that was the.

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Case.
Those are just the ones where

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people were transparent about
it, where departments were

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transparent.
About it the.

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Physical and mental toll if you
don't take care of yourself.

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This job will take.
Everything from you.

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If you allow it to.
Was there a particular moment

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that you decided you wanted to
do something, kind of change

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this culture?
There were two situations, right

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that compounded 1.
Started before it was.

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It was very shortly before I
started.

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At my fire department.
We actually had a.

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Captain at my fire department
who?

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Passed away of cardiac.
Arrest in the middle of the

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night and the crew that I
currently serve on, they were

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the ones that found him.
That that.

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Person would have been my
captain had this situation not

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occurred and the.
Truth is, it was.

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Like one of those things, it's
something that people don't see

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coming.
It's one of those things that

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compound over years because you
wouldn't look at this guy and

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think like, oh, he's.
Terribly out of shape.

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Oh, he's all this.
You know, from all accounts and

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from what my crew has told me
and what I've.

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Watched.
In them over the.

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Years as that.
Situation has affected them.

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Right.
They they.

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Went out to cut, you know, they
got a call in the middle of the

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night and they were waiting for
him to come out into the trucks

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and he didn't come out.
So they went to go check on him.

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And the captain's dorm at this
at this department is the only

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one that is separated from the
rest of the crew.

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So a couple minutes had gone by
and then when they went in

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there, they found him face down
on the ground next to his bunk.

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It had passed of a cardiac
arrest.

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And if you know anything about
firefighters, we're also

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paramedics at my department.
They had to.

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Do CPR on him as well, right?
Which it's different when it's

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somebody that you know and I can
only imagine.

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Because like I sit at the table.
With these guys, every morning,

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you know, you drink coffee, you
get to know their families, you

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get to know their stories.
You spend 24 hours of time you

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see them more than your family.
So watching that unfold.

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Shortly after I had arrived at
this.

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Department combined with that
uncle that I told you.

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About he passed away.
Six months into his retirement

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and he was the kind of guy that
he loved this job so much.

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He went from being a what's
called the Battalion Chief, went

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and retired from his department
and then went and started over

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at a new department working on
an ambulance.

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Again, he didn't do like a
lateral transfer.

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He went like very to the bottom
rung, worked on an ambulance.

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That's the kind of guy he was.
And he did it with a smile on

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his face.
I never heard, I never heard

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complain out of him.
And six months in, you know,

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again both.
Of these stories widowed.

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Wives, teenage children left
behind and fire departments that

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will never be the same again.
So you ask.

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What were the things?
That started.

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Some of this.
It's it's the.

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Recognition that, one, those
things happened, but two, that

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they were not unique to me or my
fire department, that these

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happen every day.
I feel like we.

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We get notified on an e-mail
from like the International

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Association of Firefighters
every day that we have a line of

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duty death.
I get them.

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I get them every other day.
Every other day.

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I get a a notification about a
firefighter that died from

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either cancer.
Or cardiac arrest?

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What's?
Worse is that we've normalized

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it.
It's become so normal and so

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desensitized.
And one day I caught myself

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looking at my phone and I saw
another e-mail and I went, oh,

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there goes another one.
And I went, wait a minute.

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That cannot be my response to
this.

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There's a human life on the
other end of that headline.

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I can't.
I can't be so desensitized if

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this.
Kid, this is so.

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Frequent that it's such a
problem that nobody even talks

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about it anymore.
It just comes with the job.

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It's just part of the job.
That doesn't sit well with me

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and what I'm really trying to do
is change that.

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Story for firefighters.
And change that.

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Story for the fire service so
that it's.

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Not normal anymore.
So when you talk about the fire

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service being dangerous and, and
the toll being your life, you,

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you don't just mean the dangers
on the job.

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It's not all these men are dying
on calls, no.

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The the danger is.
The slow.

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Burn in the creep over time.
It's the compounding stress

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mentally, physically, and
emotionally.

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Very, very, very few firefighter
deaths and firefighter injuries

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even come from unavoidable fire
ground operations, like somebody

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fell through a roof or fell
through the, you know, fell into

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the basement.
Had to be safe, couldn't it

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happens.
Don't get me wrong, those things

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happen.
It's just very small percentage,

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overwhelmingly the number one
cause of line of duty.

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Deaths is cardiac arrest.
Usually on the fire ground so

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somebody be inside fighting the
fire.

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Sudden cardiac arrest.
Stress Obesity over 50.

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Percent of firefighters.
Are either overweight or.

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Obese and.
That plays a large.

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Role into the comorbidities that
happen on these in these

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situations.
And so the real danger isn't the

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fire ground, it's the fire.
Culture.

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It's.
The culture we have around food,

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it's the culture we have around
supporting each other.

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So you.
Also have to take.

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This dogmatic.
Group of people and we have.

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Pride, Pride in what we do.
But sometimes it manifests.

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And when somebody's in trouble?
The.

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Support isn't always there, and
the attitude is.

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You're supposed to be.
Gritty and salty and resilient.

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So suck it up and shut up.
And So what happens is the real

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danger.
Is us to our.

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Own our own habits, our own
brothers and sisters.

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The people that we show up with
every day.

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And those habits when you
compound and zoom out over the

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course of.
Decades, right?

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These things and you you
compound it with chronic sleep

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deprivation, fatigue, stress,
family life, juggling everything

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else.
You combine that with poor.

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Dietary habits, poor physical.
Fitness habits, you compound

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that with no resources for your
mental health.

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I don't think we have to stretch
too far to understand.

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Why the average?
Firefighter makes it six years

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into their retirement before
dying.

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That's the average 6.
Years into a retirement after

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25.
Years of service average.

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Amount of time that a.
Firefighter stays alive.

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What do you?
Think is the biggest roadblock

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to to changing this culture to
to to decreasing the stigma

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around admitting something's
wrong and supporting each other

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I.
Think it's going to happen

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slowly, and I think it's going
to take enough people talking

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about it and realizing it.
But what what we have to

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understand is that in the fire
service, things are very slow to

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change.
There's a saying among

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firefighters, it's kind of
widely accepted.

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00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:30,880
Firefighters hate two things.
They hate change and they hate

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00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:35,360
the way that things are.
And when it comes to new

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00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:40,000
technology, new ideas, new
mentalities, the fire service is

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00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:43,200
generally behind in adopted.
They're they're on the late end

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00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:45,920
of that bell curve in whatever
area like technology.

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I'll give you an example.
The SCBA stands for

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self-contained Breathing
Apparatus.

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00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:52,640
It's the.
Air pack that we.

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00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:56,760
Wear arguably the most life
saving piece of equipment that

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we wear that enables us to go
into highly toxic environments

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and do the job that we need to
do.

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Those have been around since the
70s.

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They were not widely mandated
until the late 90s, early

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00:13:10,240 --> 00:13:13,400
2000's.
The most life saving piece of

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it.
We're talking like.

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There's no argument that this is
just the.

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Like without a doubt will save
you years of your life.

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If you were to implement it. 30
years is what it took.

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To for the most important piece
of equipment that we use 2530

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years.
So take a group of people that

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are.
Extremely resistant to change

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and very, very steeped in
tradition.

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That's.
Probably the biggest part is

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like the.
Steeping in tradition and that

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00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,320
pride that translates to.
This is a part of our.

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00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:55,600
Culture and our culture is
unique and it's special and if

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00:13:55,600 --> 00:13:58,120
you do anything to change any of
that, it's it's not just an

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00:13:58,120 --> 00:13:59,760
attack on that piece what
they've.

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00:13:59,840 --> 00:14:01,840
What we?
Feel is that it's an attack on.

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00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:05,320
All parts of the culture.
So being able.

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To separate it out and.
Say, hey, how can we?

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00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:10,360
Keep what's good.
But to answer your question,

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00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:13,080
whoever.
Talks about this stuff.

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Whether it's me or somebody else
in the.

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00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:18,560
Fire Service.
Advocating for these things.

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They they have to.
They themselves have to be

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00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:24,760
resilient because the backlash.
That.

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00:14:24,760 --> 00:14:29,120
Whether I've personally received
at my own fire department or

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00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,120
online, you know.
Or just for for.

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00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:35,720
Talking about differences like
those people, they have to stay

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00:14:35,720 --> 00:14:37,000
strong and they have to stay
together.

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I've made it a really big point
to make connections with other

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00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:45,440
people in this space, share
camaraderie amongst ourselves

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00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:48,720
and to.
Do it together because.

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At the end of the day, I think
if we can combine into a

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00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:53,800
movement.
Of firefighters.

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00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:56,480
Who are working towards these
things?

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00:14:57,280 --> 00:15:01,440
It goes back to the old saying
that if you want to go fast, go

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00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:05,040
alone, but if you want to go
far, then go together.

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00:15:06,040 --> 00:15:11,120
Boy, it stuns and saddens me
that men can be so attached to

291
00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:13,680
tradition even when that
tradition is killing them.

292
00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:17,080
Yeah.
And it's, I mean that's.

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00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:21,480
That's the stake, but it's hard.
To think of it in those terms

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00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:23,960
because.
You have to be.

295
00:15:23,960 --> 00:15:26,920
Able to zoom out and look at the
launch and look at like what's

296
00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:29,600
happening from a big like the
from the top of the mountain,

297
00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:33,000
what is happening?
What do I see all we know right

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00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:35,120
now a lot of.
Firefighters like life is so

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00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:36,680
hard.
The only thing that they can

300
00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:39,520
even be bothered to think about
is how do I get through the next

301
00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:42,080
shift?
How do I get through?

302
00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:46,000
You know the the next overtime.
How do I get?

303
00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:49,440
How do I?
Get to the end of the next day

304
00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:55,680
and survive.
And so some would even take the

305
00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:56,960
stake.
Like yeah, I got.

306
00:15:56,960 --> 00:15:59,200
Into this, knowing that it would
end my life early.

307
00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:01,280
But that's how much the
tradition is worth to me.

308
00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:03,200
And that.
Is where we will.

309
00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:05,960
That is where I will draw the.
Line and say no.

310
00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:07,960
Like.
I don't.

311
00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:11,320
I don't believe there's no value
in tradition.

312
00:16:11,960 --> 00:16:15,680
But I, I.
Better understand what?

313
00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:18,560
The purpose is if the if the
sake of.

314
00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:21,880
Keeping a tradition is.
For the sake of.

315
00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:25,680
Tradition itself, then we might
we might need to evaluate.

316
00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:28,520
That.
If there's a purpose and a value

317
00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:30,960
and it brings people together
and there's some kind of reason

318
00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:34,400
that actually like translates to
a positive benefit to the crew.

319
00:16:34,400 --> 00:16:36,920
Or the the people.
Practicing that tradition then

320
00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:41,520
OK, great.
But times change and it's it the

321
00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:44,880
fire service isn't unique enough
that we are impervious to the

322
00:16:44,880 --> 00:16:48,840
passing of time as the in the
world as it changes and we have.

323
00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:52,640
To art we pride.
Ourselves on being masters of

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00:16:52,640 --> 00:16:55,520
adaptation.
We pride ourselves on the

325
00:16:55,520 --> 00:16:58,160
ability to improvise, adapt and
overcome.

326
00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:02,760
Very quickly.
Unless it comes to changing the

327
00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:04,760
culture or changing our own
personal habits.

328
00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:10,119
Well, so I certainly see the
need and all of your experiences

329
00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:14,280
that went into creating your
program reclaim so, so tell me a

330
00:17:14,280 --> 00:17:18,200
bit about that.
Reclaim is a program that has

331
00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:23,079
been designed.
For firefighters, that.

332
00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:27,000
Are struggling and need help.
With.

333
00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:30,520
Solving some of the.
Habits that we.

334
00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:33,280
Have around health and fitness
that the job make very difficult

335
00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:38,280
and the reason there are other
firefighter programs, many if

336
00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:42,800
not all of them lean into
burnout more than anything and I

337
00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:46,920
don't see as a solution to the
longevity that we need inside.

338
00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:49,360
Of this career.
Something you can actually do

339
00:17:49,360 --> 00:17:52,160
with consistency over the course
of 20 or 25 years.

340
00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:54,520
Something that doesn't consume
your life.

341
00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:57,000
Something that doesn't take.
The attitude that the.

342
00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:00,320
Only things you should do with
your time is work out and show

343
00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:03,600
up on shift.
Because I have to believe that

344
00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:04,920
if.
If you're going to do this

345
00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:08,360
career for 20 or 25.
Years that you should have the.

346
00:18:08,360 --> 00:18:11,720
Opportunity to enjoy it too.
It shouldn't just be gritting

347
00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:14,640
your teeth the entire time.
There has to be more to life

348
00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:18,800
than just those two things that
make life worth living, and

349
00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:21,480
that's usually the trade.
Off that, firefighters feel like

350
00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:22,320
they.
Have to make.

351
00:18:22,840 --> 00:18:24,840
It's like.
I can either spend time with my

352
00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:30,320
kids or my family, or I can go
to the gym, and nine times out

353
00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:34,760
of 10, probably more, they're
going to choose the other option

354
00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:37,760
that has more value.
But my point is that what?

355
00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:40,000
If you could do both, what if
the?

356
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:44,200
Fitness industry is wrong.
What if this idea that you have

357
00:18:44,200 --> 00:18:46,400
to work?
Out six, seven times a week.

358
00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:49,280
Eat 6 meals a day, which is
unrealistic.

359
00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:51,520
For the lifestyle of a
firefighter who's already.

360
00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:52,840
Burnt out.
By the job.

361
00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:56,000
What if you could significantly
reduce that and see better

362
00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:57,400
results than you ever have
before?

363
00:18:57,880 --> 00:19:00,720
What if you could maintain your
health by having a smart?

364
00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:04,560
Structure.
Rather than just adding more

365
00:19:04,560 --> 00:19:07,720
volume and more burnout.
So this program, it's for the

366
00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:11,240
firefighter that wants to.
Realize that the real.

367
00:19:11,240 --> 00:19:13,840
Flex is being able to.
Keep up with their kids.

368
00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:17,920
Or their grandkids, to not have
the job rob them of all the life

369
00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:24,480
and longevity, to not retire
broken, To have a space where

370
00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:28,760
they can feel and operate and
perform.

371
00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:32,040
To their absolute best.
And not have.

372
00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:33,840
To sacrifice all.
The other things in the

373
00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:36,600
meantime.
You talked about the importance

374
00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:39,720
of community earlier.
Does community play a part in in

375
00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:41,880
Reclaim It?
Does this and that's exactly the

376
00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:47,040
reason that I have chosen to
host Reclaim on a community

377
00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:52,560
based platform to.
Keep everybody motivated

378
00:19:52,560 --> 00:19:55,800
together.
Working towards the same things

379
00:19:55,800 --> 00:19:58,960
with the same values and it goes
back to that statement like we

380
00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:00,800
are stronger together so we
bring.

381
00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:05,880
All of the firefighters who.
Are on board with this message

382
00:20:05,880 --> 00:20:09,960
into one space to communicate,
to connect, to learn together,

383
00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:12,960
and to benefit from each
other's.

384
00:20:12,960 --> 00:20:16,480
Growth to talk about.
Their own journeys and what has

385
00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:19,880
worked for them, what hasn't
worked for them into a communal

386
00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:24,760
space and the connections that
I've seen grow just from that

387
00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:28,960
have been amazing.
Whether it's like the

388
00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:32,320
firefighters with their coaches
or whether it's the firefighters

389
00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:36,240
with each other.
So there's definitely a strong

390
00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:40,200
warrior culture and and all
emergency services.

391
00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:45,560
What can be done to redefine
that warrior mindset to include

392
00:20:46,040 --> 00:20:50,200
Wellness and emotional strength
and and acknowledging struggles?

393
00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:52,560
I think we have to.
Redefine.

394
00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:55,960
Maybe not you and me, but like
as a culture in the fire service

395
00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:59,120
or first responders in general.
People think that being a

396
00:20:59,120 --> 00:21:02,280
warrior is a physical
performance.

397
00:21:03,080 --> 00:21:05,520
We need to redefine what that.
Is a true warrior.

398
00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:09,680
Is not somebody who performs
well, it's somebody who has

399
00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:13,040
mastery over themselves.
It is somebody.

400
00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:16,000
Who realizes that the real
battle is?

401
00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:20,600
Within that, the real struggle
is within and to address.

402
00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:29,280
That to address that.
Point that it's not what happens

403
00:21:29,280 --> 00:21:32,920
in the world around us.
It is how we.

404
00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:37,560
Respond.
To that it is the degree.

405
00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:39,720
Of self mastery.
That we have over our.

406
00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:45,760
Thoughts, our emotions, our
actions, our behaviors and

407
00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:48,240
because we have been called.
To a higher level of service it.

408
00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:52,760
Demands and the.
People that we serve, they

409
00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:56,080
deserve to have people with
that.

410
00:21:56,080 --> 00:22:01,000
Level of dedication showing up
to help them when they need it

411
00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:03,480
most.
So to be a.

412
00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:07,160
Real warrior is much more of an
internal battle.

413
00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:11,040
The true self mastery isn't
about.

414
00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:14,760
The chaos of the world It is
about the chaos of your.

415
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:19,600
World internally and how you can
move through the ebb and flow

416
00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:20,080
of.
That.

417
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:23,200
How you can still learn to
respond well.

418
00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:25,120
I've said this to.
The clients that I've worked

419
00:22:25,120 --> 00:22:25,720
with.
I said if.

420
00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:30,760
I could boil down everything in
this program into one sentence.

421
00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:32,640
I would say it's learning how to
respond well.

422
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:36,160
Because what we are is first.
Responders, we're not.

423
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:40,600
First reactors A.
Reaction is spontaneous.

424
00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:44,400
It's without thought it.
Happens like a chemical reaction

425
00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:50,120
to two molecules collide and
guaranteed outcome a first

426
00:22:50,120 --> 00:22:54,320
responder.
They decide they.

427
00:22:54,320 --> 00:22:55,720
Decide how they're going to show
up.

428
00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:02,160
It's looking at the world and
saying you don't get to decide

429
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:06,160
who I'm going to be today.
That's the path.

430
00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:11,040
Of the Warrior, it's surviving a
storm in a rowboat, which the

431
00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:14,440
only way you can do.
That you keep the water out of

432
00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:17,360
the boat.
Storm can be rolling around you,

433
00:23:17,360 --> 00:23:18,880
doesn't matter.
You keep the water out of the

434
00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:23,280
boat, you'll stay afloat.
When we first spoke, you

435
00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:29,280
mentioned that they were leaders
in the fire service that say

436
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:31,600
things like if anyone has a
problem in the job, they

437
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:34,480
shouldn't be in this job, and
that if they use peer support

438
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,480
services, they were seen as
weaklings.

439
00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:39,880
Are you seeing younger
generations of firefighters be

440
00:23:39,880 --> 00:23:42,080
more open to their own health
and emotion?

441
00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:46,040
Well, emotional Well.
Being I do see I do.

442
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:49,120
See more acceptance in the the
younger generations coming in

443
00:23:49,120 --> 00:23:50,840
there.
There is like in any other

444
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:56,080
culture or community, there's,
there's going to be generational

445
00:23:56,080 --> 00:24:01,640
discrepancies and.
Yes, there there is people who

446
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,440
who say.
That you know if you if you have

447
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:09,600
a problem then there's the door
right or even attempt to disband

448
00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:12,600
some of the peer supporter pure
fitness teams that that's their

449
00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:19,920
goal and generationally and like
what I wish could be imparted on

450
00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:21,920
them is that most of the time
when when.

451
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:25,200
People have that attitude, they
have it.

452
00:24:26,920 --> 00:24:32,960
Until up until a certain point,
it usually changes, but then

453
00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:37,120
it's too late.
I think with the information age

454
00:24:37,120 --> 00:24:41,720
that we live in, the information
that's at our fingertips with

455
00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:44,960
ChatGPT and.
All the other resources that are

456
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,560
out there.
There's a little bit more of a

457
00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:52,400
educated population coming in,
more open, have seen the results

458
00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:54,440
and maybe some of the people
that have some of these

459
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:57,280
mentalities are people in their
family or people that they've

460
00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:00,360
witnessed and they're probably
taking up the mentality.

461
00:25:00,360 --> 00:25:02,320
That.
I don't.

462
00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:04,320
I don't want to be like.
That or I've.

463
00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:09,080
Seen the results of this first
hand so it's my It's my

464
00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:14,080
perception that with time this
is improving.

465
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:17,680
Or at least.
That the baseline coming in

466
00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:19,800
isn't so.
Drastically low.

467
00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:23,760
Now the problem is that they
might come in with those beliefs

468
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:25,640
of the fire service being
steeped in tradition.

469
00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:27,760
It's the you start on the very
end of the totem pole.

470
00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:29,440
So the people making the
decisions.

471
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,600
The people with these attitudes.
Are generally more so in

472
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:36,120
positions of authority and you
can lead from.

473
00:25:37,240 --> 00:25:39,280
Can lead from the bottom just
like you can lead from the top,

474
00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:43,000
but when it's coming down from
the top it makes it may.

475
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:45,160
It really, really slows.
Down your tailwind.

476
00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:50,360
Yeah, if you could wave a magic
wand and change one thing in

477
00:25:50,360 --> 00:25:52,760
Firehouse culture.
What would that be?

478
00:25:54,920 --> 00:26:00,360
If I could change one thing, it
would be having continuing

479
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:04,840
fitness standards for
firefighters and the reason I

480
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,280
chose.
That specifically is because.

481
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:13,120
It will and does have implicate
implications on like the mental.

482
00:26:13,120 --> 00:26:16,200
State the physical.
Awareness, the emotional

483
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:18,800
well-being, it's not the only
piece of the equation, but it

484
00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:22,640
has a positive benefit.
But one of the things that is a

485
00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:26,080
big sticking point for me, and
in fact, I get in, I get in a

486
00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:28,160
lot of trouble for saying this
on my I get in a lot of hot

487
00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:30,280
water for this, but I've been
very.

488
00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:32,920
Clear, very vocal that I believe
there should be.

489
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:34,600
Continuing fitness.
So like what?

490
00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:36,440
What is the problem when I say
that for anybody that's

491
00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:38,320
listening and maybe doesn't
understand fire culture?

492
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,360
There is a test.
To get hired generally.

493
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:47,240
It's called the C pat.
Now, federally speaking, after.

494
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:50,040
You get hired.
For the next 25 years, there are

495
00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:52,920
no physical requirements to keep
your job, none.

496
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:57,480
So when I say I would like to
see continuing physical

497
00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:01,840
standards and by the way, before
I move on, some departments take

498
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:05,080
it upon themselves to implement
their own, but they don't have

499
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:07,000
to.
And that's that's the other

500
00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:09,800
thing like.
The best firefighters I've ever

501
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:12,520
worked with.
Held themselves to a much higher

502
00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:16,720
standard than their department
ever held them to or their

503
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:18,720
cities or their jurisdictions
ever held them to.

504
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:22,760
And so those departments exist,
but there's only about 30%

505
00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:27,640
nationwide, 30% have any kind of
continuing standard and that

506
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:30,120
standard since it's not.
Like.

507
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:34,600
Federally defined can be
whatever they want it to be and

508
00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:37,400
they can pencil whip and they do
so like within that 30% like how

509
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:39,760
much is actually adequate and
how much is actually

510
00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:44,000
standardized so.
To just have a culture where.

511
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:47,280
This is taken seriously and that
it's important, and that's a

512
00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:50,080
piece of the equation as.
Seriously, as we take.

513
00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:52,640
Fire ground operations as.
Seriously, as we take.

514
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:56,160
Everything else that we do on
the on the job, if I could

515
00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:57,600
change one thing, it would just
be the.

516
00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:00,440
The idea?
And the level.

517
00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:04,840
Of priority that physical.
Fitness is put in the fire

518
00:28:04,840 --> 00:28:06,600
service.
Itself to a degree.

519
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:08,120
Where it's actually something
that.

520
00:28:08,120 --> 00:28:12,040
You are expected to.
Perform graded on and.

521
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:15,600
Evaluated and ideally.
What does a healthy?

522
00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:18,440
Retirement for someone coming
out of the fire service look

523
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:21,440
like.
Best case scenario would be

524
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:23,920
coming out of.
The fire service.

525
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:29,800
With your relationships intact,
family, friends, this is one of

526
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:32,160
the things you see in the fire.
Service people like Retreat.

527
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,800
Into the culture, so much so
that like they stop being able

528
00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:36,400
to identify with anybody
outside.

529
00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:40,960
Of the fire service rate of
divorce is very high the.

530
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:50,080
Best case scenario is coming out
with the mental and emotional.

531
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:52,200
Capacities to still.
Have maintained your

532
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:54,360
relationships.
With the.

533
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:57,400
People that you care about most
and.

534
00:28:57,920 --> 00:29:01,720
To retire without a body that.
Has been broken and worn down by

535
00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:07,160
injury and and misuse.
To actually live through 30 or

536
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:08,800
40 years.
After your retirement.

537
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:11,760
To be.
Able to get down on the ground

538
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:13,960
and play with your kids or your
grandkids.

539
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:19,000
To be able to.
Go on that hike even at the age

540
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:24,200
of 556570, rather than be stuck
in place, immobile in a body

541
00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:29,160
that's full of pain.
Just a healthy, resilient person

542
00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:32,680
with their relationships intact.
Robbie.

543
00:29:32,680 --> 00:29:34,880
What's one thing you wish that
more men knew?

544
00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:39,160
I wish that more men knew.
That.

545
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:45,520
Emotional resilience Mental
strength does not equate and is

546
00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:48,160
not synonymous with weakness or
softness.

547
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,560
We go back to being this topic.
Of of a warrior.

548
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:53,960
Having control over yourself
how?

549
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:59,120
Like self mastery means having
understanding, it means that

550
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,920
instead of bottling it away
because it's quote UN quote.

551
00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:06,120
Weak look.
It in the eye, acknowledge it

552
00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:07,200
for what it.
Is.

553
00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:13,040
And then take control of it.
More men need to understand that

554
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:18,640
emotional resilience comes from
first struggling with those

555
00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:22,840
emotions, which you you won't
have an opportunity to do if you

556
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:26,560
push it down, then getting
familiar, getting comfortable

557
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:31,400
with those, and then still
responding well if you want to

558
00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:36,520
be a leader, if you want to be.
A caretaker.

559
00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:42,120
A provider.
That means having that emotional

560
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:47,400
maturity that comes from the
experience of acknowledging and

561
00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:50,320
working through those emotions
and those mental states.

562
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:55,320
More men need to.
Realize that it's.

563
00:30:55,360 --> 00:30:59,120
OK to feel it's not.
OK to act, however.

564
00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:01,800
You want, but that's the whole
point, right?

565
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:02,920
Is that you?
Decide.

566
00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:09,320
You decide that.
Where that line is between who's

567
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:11,200
the person I'm going to.
Be today.

568
00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:13,840
And I'm the only one that gets.
To decide that.

569
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:18,600
Also, Robbie, I want to thank
you for your work as a

570
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:24,080
firefighter and your work and
trying to save firefighters from

571
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:26,360
themselves from this distorted.
Tradition.

572
00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:29,200
That that's that's ending lives
prematurely.

573
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,520
So Robbie, what's the best way
that people can get in touch

574
00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:36,280
with you and learn more about
the program or claim?

575
00:31:36,440 --> 00:31:38,280
Yes, there's a.
There's a couple different ways,

576
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:41,720
I'll just I'll make it simple.
The best way would be.

577
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:46,880
On Instagram, my handle.
Is at Robb i.e.

578
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:50,640
And EBS, very simple.
Robbie Nebs, you find me there.

579
00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:52,000
I'm the firefighter fitness
coach.

580
00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:57,400
From there you can also find
links to book consultation calls

581
00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:59,160
or find my free school
community.

582
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:01,360
That I do have for firefighters
as well.

583
00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:04,880
To give them like the baseline
knowledge to help get on top of

584
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:06,480
some of these things that we.
Discussed today and.

585
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:09,280
You can also find me on.
YouTube I do.

586
00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:13,720
My own podcast revolving around
fire firefighter fitness topics

587
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:17,520
that's Reclaim Fitness Group on
on YouTube.

588
00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:22,880
Robbie, thanks again for sharing
your experience, your time with

589
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:26,280
us.
And yeah, I I hope you reach a

590
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:29,040
lot more guys.
This is important and really

591
00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:32,280
appreciate giving us a peek
inside this culture which I did

592
00:32:32,280 --> 00:32:36,080
not realize was still still such
a strangling culture for for

593
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:38,240
men.
That was Robbie Nebergall with a

594
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:42,080
powerful reminder that being
strong isn't about hiding pain.

595
00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:44,440
It's about.
Confronting it whether you're a.

596
00:32:44,440 --> 00:32:47,120
First responder or just someone
looking to reclaim your health,

597
00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:49,680
purpose and peace, Robbie's
message hits home.

598
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:51,840
And remember, you don't have to
do this.

599
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:53,360
Work alone.
Join us.

600
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:57,920
In the authentic AF community at
realmenfield.org/group.

601
00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:01,200
Until next time, be good to
yourself.